Negative perception of the Religion of Peace(tm) increasing

[The Beer Slayer]

Inconceivable!

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 02221.html

Negative perceptions of Islam increasing
Poll numbers in U.S. higher than in 2001

By Claudia Deane and Darryl Fears

The Washington Post
Updated: 7:41 a.m. ET March 9, 2006

As the war in Iraq grinds into its fourth year, a growing proportion of Americans are expressing unfavorable views of Islam, and a majority now say that Muslims are disproportionately prone to violence, according to a new Washington Post-ABC News poll.

The poll found that nearly half of Americans -- 46 percent -- have a negative view of Islam, seven percentage points higher than in the tense months after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, when Muslims were often targeted for violence.


The survey comes at a time of increasing tension; the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq show little sign of ending, and members of Congress are seeking to block the Bush administration's attempt to hire an Arab company to manage operations at six of the nation's ports. Also, Americans are reading news of deadly protests by Muslims over Danish cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad.

Conservative and liberal experts said Americans' attitudes about Islam are fueled in part by political statements and media reports that focus almost solely on the actions of Muslim extremists.

According to the poll, the proportion of Americans who believe that Islam helps to stoke violence against non-Muslims has more than doubled since the attacks, from 14 percent in January 2002 to 33 percent today.

The survey also found that one in three Americans have heard prejudiced comments about Muslims lately. In a separate question, slightly more (43 percent) reported having heard negative remarks about Arabs. One in four Americans admitted to harboring prejudice toward Muslims, the same proportion that expressed some personal bias against Arabs.

Though the two groups are often linked in popular discourse, most of the world's Muslims are not of Arab descent. For example, the country with the largest Muslim population is Indonesia.

As a school bus driver in Chicago, Gary McCord, 65, dealt with many children of Arab descent. "Some of the best families I've ever had were some of my Muslim families," he said in a follow-up interview. "They were so nice to me." He now works for a Palestinian Christian family, whose members he says are "really marvelous."

‘Because I think they preach hate’
But his good feelings do not extend to Islam. "I don't mean to sound harsh or anything, but I don't like what the Muslim people believe in, according to the Koran. Because I think they preach hate," he said.

As for the controversial cartoons of Muhammad, he said Arabs seem hypersensitive about religion. "I think it's been blown out of proportion," he said.

Frederick Cole, a welder in Roosevelt, Utah, acknowledged: "As far as being prejudiced against them, I'd have to say maybe a little bit. If I were to go through an airport and I saw one out of the corner of my eye, I'd say, 'I wonder what he's thinking.' " Still, Cole, 30, said, "I don't think the religion is based on just wanting to terrorize people."

A total of 1,000 randomly selected Americans were interviewed March 2-5 for this Post-ABC News poll. The margin of sampling error for the overall results is plus or minus three percentage points.

Americans who said they understood Islam were more likely to see the religion overall as peaceful and respectful. But they were no less likely to say it harbors harmful extremists, and they were also no less likely to have prejudiced feelings against Muslims.

In Gadsden, Ala., Ron Hardy, an auto parts supplier, said Arabs own a lot of stores in his area and "they're okay." But, Hardy, 41, said "I do think" Islam has been "hijacked by some militant-like guys."

Edward Rios, 31, an engineer in McHenry, Ill., said he feels that Islam "is as good a religion as any other" yet vengeance seems to be "built into their own set of beliefs: If someone attacks our people, it is your duty to defend them. . . . I don't think Christianity has anything like that."

James J. Zogby, president of the Washington-based Arab American Institute, said he is not surprised by the poll's results. Politicians, authors and media commentators have demonized the Arab world since 2001, he said.

‘A vein that’s very near the surface’

"The intensity has not abated and remains a vein that's very near the surface, ready to be tapped at any moment," Zogby said. "Members of Congress have been exploiting this over the ports issue. Radio commentators have been talking about it nonstop."

Juan Cole, a professor of modern Middle Eastern and South Asian history at the University of Michigan, agreed, saying Americans "have been given the message to respond this way by the American political elite, mass media and by select special interests."

Cole said he was shocked when a radio talk show host asked him if Islamic extremists would set off a nuclear bomb in the United States in the next six months. "It was ridiculous. I think anti-Arab racism and profiling has become respectable," he said.

Ronald Stockton, a professor of political science at the University of Michigan at Dearborn who helped conduct a study of Arabs in the Detroit area and on views of them held by non-Arabs, said an exceptionally high percentage of non-Muslims feels the media depicts Arabs unfairly, yet still holds negative opinions.

"You're getting a constant drumbeat of negative information about Islam," he said.

Michael Franc, vice president of government relations for the conservative Heritage Foundation, said that the survey responses "seems to me to be a real backlash against Islam" and that congressional leaders do not help the problem by sometimes using language that links all Muslims with extremists.

Polling director Richard Morin contributed to this report.
© 2006 The Washington Post Company

[Lonewulf]

What we should do is get all the more moderate Muslims here in the U.S., and send them out on "peace" operations vs. the Extremist Muslims.

Problem solved. Public opinion doesn't falter as much for the overall body, thus lessening the chance of aggression being shown towards Muslims in general.

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

Gosh, and I always thought Americans 'are disproportionately prone to violence'.
(And I got statistics to back me up.) :wink:

If jingoism comes from the general media, rather than just from the government, things can get really bad really fast.

[The Beer Slayer]

Gosh, and I always thought Americans 'are disproportionately prone to violence'.
(And I got statistics to back me up.) :wink:

If jingoism comes from the general media, rather than just from the government, things can get really bad really fast.

America is a more violent country than many others. Colombia is a more violent country than America. And Islam is a more violent religion, on the whole, than others, though people are loathe to say it in public. The negative perception of Islam isn't the result of "media jingoism." It's the result of the actions of Muslims.

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

And Islam is a more violent religion, on the whole, than others, though people are loathe to say it in public. The negative perception of Islam isn't the result of "media jingoism." It's the result of the actions of Muslims.

Do you have statistics to back that up?

Remember, there are 1.3 billion alleged Muslims.

[The Beer Slayer]

So?

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

So?

WARNING: fictional numbers, just for demonstration purposes.

1,300,000,000 Muslims - 500,000 terrorists
350 Branch Davidians - 50 terrorists

You do the math.

Do you have statistics?

If you were to argue that, within the Islamic world there are cultures, which, aggravated by religious interpretations, are more inducive toward violent behaviour, more so than for example Denmark, then we have something that can actually be debated.
Saying 'because I think they preach hate' is in fact preaching hate.
There is no they, there are some 1,300,000,000 individuals.

[Lonewulf]

Sometimes, Halcyon actually impresses me.

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

Thank you, thank you... *bows*

I just confronted a bunch of Holocaust deniers on GLP.
The adrenaline was still flowing.

[The Beer Slayer]

No, I don't know anyone who keeps these kinds of statistics. But would you say that within the Islamic world there is significantly more religiously-motivated violence than in other religions? Violence that is directed against both Muslims and non-Muslims alike?

[The Beer Slayer]

Let's get more basic. Do you think it is possible for one religion to be more conducive to violence than another?

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

But would you say that within the Islamic world there is significantly more religiously-motivated violence than in other religions?

Of the major religions, at this point of history, probably.

That does not diminish the fact that the sentiments expressed in the OP reflects blatant prejudice against 1/5 of the human race, across the board.
And these sentiments are in fact inducive to violence, motivated by a mostly non-religious ideology. A jingoistic ideology based on prejudice, fear and hatred.
Politically, religions are just a subset of ideologies.
And ideologies like these will only lead to violent conflict.
It is ideologies like these which are the enemy.

We are supposed to be better then the bad guys.
But we think just like them.

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

Let's get more basic. Do you think it is possible for one religion to be more conducive to violence than another?

So many heads, so many minds.

Sure, just think of the historic cults of the Thuggees, the Hashshashin or the Dominican Order.

But..

A religion, or ideology, is a collection of ideas and notions, many of them of course quite irrational. Only a ideology adhered to by a single person can be clearly defined.
The larger the group, the more variation.
So many heads, so many minds.
My point being, among the people allegedly adhering to Islam, or any other religion or ideology, you will find a vast variation of actual attitudes to many things.
Many Muslim are mindless frothing-at-the-mouth reli-maniacs. Many Muslims are saints.

Never, ever judge a person based on the plaque on the building s/he chooses to worship/gather.
It would just be another variation on the ancient theme of bigotry.

Which, of course, is exactly what we should be trying to avoid.

[The Beer Slayer]

In a way you just said exactly what I was going to say: Islam is more than a religion, it's also a political ideology. It's very political as far as as religions go. As such, it should be open to criticism, just like socialism, constitutionalism, or anything else.

That does not diminish the fact that the sentiments expressed in the OP reflects blatant prejudice against 1/5 of the human race, across the board.

I'm not talking about what color people are, or what race they are or what country they're born in. I'm talking about what they believe. Beliefs have consequences. Beliefs motivate people to do things. Beliefs should be open to harsh examination. And that goes for religion, too.

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

I keep using the expression 'allegedly adhering to Islam' because I'm quite convinced that in Islam, as well as many other settings, historical and present, there are plenty of people who more or less go through the motions without actually believing.
Inside they don't care, or are agnostic, or are heretics, etc.
They just go through life pretending. Motivated by all sorts of fears.
Fear of being a misfit, fear of retaliation from fundies or religious authorities, fear of ridicule, fear of economic consequences, etc.
True freedom of religion is pretty much a thing of modernity.
And far from perfect, as it is.

I think I don't really approve of organised religion. :wink:
It is hostile to personal freedom.

[The Beer Slayer]

A religion, or ideology, is a collection of ideas and notions, many of them of course quite irrational. Only a ideology adhered to by a single person can be clearly defined.
The larger the group, the more variation.
So many heads, so many minds.
My point being, among the people allegedly adhering to Islam, or any other religion or ideology, you will find a vast variation of actual attitudes to many things.

As far as judging individuals whom we meet in day-to-day life, yes. But on another level, making any kind of policy involves some generalizations. We are more likely to be threatened by Muslims acting in the name of their religion than by people acting in the name of another religion, or by secular terrorists for that matter. We should have the guts to admit that and stop chanting this mantra about how Islam is a "religion of peace."

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

Beliefs have consequences. Beliefs motivate people to do things. Beliefs should be open to harsh examination. And that goes for religion, too.

You are absolutely right.

Ideas can lead to actions which give cause to fear.
But we must not allow our fears to lead to hate.
It's very counter-productive.
Why listen to the arguments of someone who hates you anyway?
And it pays to be on the good side of the moderates.
They are the hope for the future in the Islamic world.
We can't allow the bad guys to win.
And sometimes shooting at people means they have won.

[Halcyon Dayz, FCD]

We should have the guts to admit that and stop chanting this mantra about how Islam is a "religion of peace."

For part of the Muslims Islam is a religion of peace, and for part it is absolutely not. The sentiments expressed in the OP-article do however not express that. As usually, people put little thought in to things and generalise. And there lies the danger.
The opposition does exactly the same thing.

Also, terrorism is not the greatest danger to the free world on a political level.
It is how we respond to it.

[Candy]

Also, terrorism is not the greatest danger to the free world on a political level.
It is how we respond to it.

Tell that to this person who just voted for democracy.

[Lonewulf]

And the person that votes for the eradication of free speech.

[Мастер]

Also, terrorism is not the greatest danger to the free world on a political level.
It is how we respond to it.

I would agree with that. The 2001 attacks in New York and Washington killed a number of people roughly equal to the number killed in one month in traffic accidents in the US. And yet there has been no invasion of Detroit and other vehicle production locations...

[Lonewulf]

I would agree with that. The 2001 attacks in New York and Washington killed a number of people roughly equal to the number killed in one month in traffic accidents in the US. And yet there has been no invasion of Detroit and other vehicle production locations...

Yeah, but that *is* over fifty states, and over an entire month; it's not like it's one single attack. Further, the car accidents don't attack the economy as much as the eradication of the Towers (from what I know).

But I still agree with the idea that our responce to the attacks was a little over-the-top. It's all political, really.

[taks]

I would agree with that. The 2001 attacks in New York and Washington killed a number of people roughly equal to the number killed in one month in traffic accidents in the US. And yet there has been no invasion of Detroit and other vehicle production locations...

i bolded and italicized the words that invalidate the analogy.

taks

[Мастер]

I would agree with that. The 2001 attacks in New York and Washington killed a number of people roughly equal to the number killed in one month in traffic accidents in the US. And yet there has been no invasion of Detroit and other vehicle production locations...

i bolded and italicized the words that invalidate the analogy.

taks

Thank you for validating my point - people take completely different attitudes towards deaths from different causes.

[taks]

I would agree with that. The 2001 attacks in New York and Washington killed a number of people roughly equal to the number killed in one month in traffic accidents in the US. And yet there has been no invasion of Detroit and other vehicle production locations...

i bolded and italicized the words that invalidate the analogy.

taks

Thank you for validating my point - people take completely different attitudes towards deaths from different causes.

i didn't validate anything. you're attempting to relate intentional deaths to accidents. it's not about cause, it is about intent.

taks