Illuminati-R-Us

Ex Chess World Champion and noted, umm, eccentric, Bobby Fischer died today in Reykyavik, Iceland, where he had been enjoying permanent residency after renouncing his American citizenship in 2005.

FAZ reports that the cause of death was renal failure, CNN writes "no cause of death was given".

Brilliant? Certainly.

Will I miss him? Not the least bit.

Bobby Fischer was one of, if not the, greatest chess players ever to have lived. (He actually credited Paul Morphy with that distinction) For a period in my mid teens when I was a “chess nut”, he was much admired.

Bobby sought to create the concept of professional, “commercialized” chess. Frustrated by “professional” golfers winning purses of hundreds of thousands of dollars while winners of chess tournaments received purses of hundreds or a few thousands of dollars, he demanded more. To a great extent, he succeeded.

In Iceland in 1972 he defeated the Russian world champion, Boris Spassky (and his rumoured secret support team of Russian grandmasters*) after holding out for a purse of $250,000. At the height of the cold war, defeating the Russians at chess was probably more devastating than nuking the Kremlin. Invaluable to America in the propaganda war.

{*No disrespect to Boris Spassky, a gentleman and world class chess grandmaster; just the reality of the politics of the day.}

Sadly, like many geniuses, Bobby was not very socially or politically apt and may have devolved into paranoia or madness.

Instead of riding the crest of the wave he created to wealth and popularity, he spiraled down to ignominy.

To put a more human face on Bobby, a story from Iceland in 1972.

Bobby called the home of a chess player and friend and asked for him. The young daughter of the friend (who was not home) answered the phone. She spoke no English. Bobby spoke no Icelandic. There was a conversation of about a minute.

Later, meeting his friend, Bobby recounted the conversation word for word, so perfect in inflection and accent that his friend could tell Bobby exactly what his daughter had said.

{As told by Frank Brady in the book “The Chess of Bobby Fischer”.}

I salute his genius, and mourn the loss of … so much more that might have been.

First things first -- how much of what he was quoted as saying did he actually say? Next -- how much of what he was quoted as saying was taken out of context?

Let's get that cleared up before we start slamming him.

I only saw one video of a complete quote that he made. And what he said was actually technically correct. That is what makes a good logical thinking. You have to thow away what you think is true and look at things mathematically. You can be technically correct and yet politically incorrect. What he said was that The United States has no legal right to exist. That is technically correct.

What??? Bill, perhaps you should take more than 30 seconds to craft a response that should take at least 30 minutes. If you reply, remember this thread is about Bobby Fischer. If you know little or nothing about him, you should research before posting ambigious comments. He was not a politician, or a mathematician. He was not a well rounded person. A little respect for his accomplishments. A little sympathy for his frailities.

The intention of an "RIP" thread is never to slam the deceased person. I don't know how you could get this absurd idea, BT. We know from reading your contributions that slamming your current favourite hate object (Sen. Clinton, Britney Spears, Dragon Star...) is one of your favourite pastimes, but this thread (as most others on this board) was in no way intended to follow you down that path.

If you want to avail yourself of informations about Bobby Fischer and what he said and did in his life, use the usual placeto start. Of course you will ask me how I know the Wikipedia article doesn't take everything out of context yadda, yadda, but the list of citations is rich and you might as well explore from there. If your post was guided by any sincere interest, which I don't think it was.

All my OP wanted to convey was "R.I.P. Bobby Fischer", period. How you can read any other intention into the post escapes my grasp.

KLA2 and Arneb:

As I read it, Bill's comments are in support of Bobby Fischer, not against him.

Please explain where I have misunderstood his intentions.

Lance wrote:KLA2 and Arneb:

As I read it, Bill's comments are in support of Bobby Fischer, not against him.

Please explain where I have misunderstood his intentions.

And I don't see where KLA2 and Arneb refute that.

Lance, I stand by my post. Was BT positive? Was he negative? “Before we start slamming him …” Did he really say anything? Did he provide a link? Did he reveal any knowledge of the subject other than having seen “one video of a complete quote”?

Does it not seem to you that the post was ambiguous and made so hastily as to be virtually meaningless, albeit with a general negative overtone?

That’s how it seemed to me. If I am wrong, and overreacted, I am sure Bill will find it in his heart to forgive me.

Consider the phrase:

"Let's make sure we know what we're doing before we go off running around like chickens with our heads cut off."

This is not mean to infer that I desire to go running around LACWMHCO. Quite the opposite is true.

Perhaps I misinterpretted it, but that is how I parsed Bill's statement.

OK, Lance. A good admin (or mod) is like a good referee. You are a very good admin, so I accept your call. Two minutes in the box to cool off, and I’ll meet BT back out on the thread.

In case Bill comes back to this thread, Bill, take it as a compliment that I want to hear more from you than a brief "sound bite." :P

We now return to the previously scheduled eulogy. :(

Bill seemed to be implying that things WERE being taken out of context and that we WERE slamming Bobby. That is what I saw in his post.

Bobby Fischer and I once beat up a couple of drunks outside of CBGB's in NYC. He also ate an entire loaf of rye bread with peanut butter on a bet (I lost). He was fun to hang out with.

Woof! - Scott

I am at a loss to say because I have come to find that whatever I say it will be misread.

I can't help but think that some people here might be a few steps behind as far as events and history goes. So, just to be clear, lets start at the beginning. Fischer was not wanted by the United States government because officials wanted a hug and an autograph. The military and people devoting their lives to protecting our country also didn't have a kind word for him.

His anti-Semitic diatribes in radio interviews and - most unforgivably for his fellow countrymen - his support for the 11 September 2001 attacks on the US all tarnished his legend.

The things he said about 9-11 were pretty shocking. It is hard to overlook someone who is happy about 9-11. In fact, he seemed more praising and joyful than Osama bin Laden appeared to be.

Maybe, like Einstien, the brain compensates for great talent by taking something else away and if his talent for supreme logic had not been tapped by chess, he would be some outcasted homeless person. Or maybe what he said was not as bad as it was reported to be. Or maybe, in some supremely logical way that is technically correct while being politically incorrect, he was not technically wrong. On the other hand, eventhough, as he said, the United States has no right to exist, the same can be said for about 40 countries on earth. Maybe he saw the world as a giant chess set.

We know these things about Bobby.

Bill if this post was what the first one was trying to say, it is unfortunate you did not make this post first. The first post really sounded to me like you were scolding us. This later post seems to convey more of a message about Fischer.

One could argue that no country has a right to exist. Who after all can legally grant someone else such a right. Ultimately everywhere was taken from someone.

Enzo wrote:One could argue that no country has a right to exist. Who after all can legally grant someone else such a right.

I am somewhat inclined to make this argument at times.

Saddam Hussein argued that the court trying him was the instrument of an illegitimate government, being the result of foreign military invasion. I am not sure whence Saddam's own legitimacy was supposed to have sprung...

Interesting discussion - this thread has progressed since I last called in. I'd like to say that I agree with Enzo's interpretation of my post answering BT.

I read BT's post as insinuating that Kla2 and I wanted to "slam" Bobby Fischer, which we both didn't. We were both miffed at this insinuation and tried to explain why and how it was absurd to read any intention of "slamming" into our posts.

Lance's observation that BT was in support of Bobby Fischer is of course correct. But we never denied it was, and it was not what we were miffed at.

Ah, now I see. Sorry guys.

I knew I was missing something but I didn't know what.

Bottom line is that he posted what he actually meant in detail, so we can drop the first post and move on to the second, that of which, I find to be a good post and an excellent point. :) But it's still no excuse, everyone is expected to control themselves.

Arneb wrote:Interesting discussion - this thread has progressed since I last called in. I'd like to say that I agree with Enzo's interpretation of my post answering BT.

I read BT's post as insinuating that Kla2 and I wanted to "slam" Bobby Fischer, which we both didn't. We were both miffed at this insinuation and tried to explain why and how it was absurd to read any intention of "slamming" into our posts.

Lance's observation that BT was in support of Bobby Fischer is of course correct. But we never denied it was, and it was not what we were miffed at.

It was my first impulse to slam Fischer.

In that case I can only say be a good citizen (perhaps a better one than Fischer was, but I'll leave that question open) and don't slam anyone in an RIP thread.

De mortuis nil nisi bene - That is often translated in the sense of "about the dead, only good things". But I suspect it is more like "about the dead, nothing if not in a good manner" (as the grammar suggests). Meaning, you don't have to become exalted about what a fantastic fellow someone was only because he is dead; but say what you have to say in a composed, well thought-out, polite and - wll maybe that's the right word - subdued manner. All, but not slamming.

"The evil that men do lives after them, The good is oft interred with their bones."

- WS

Blue Monster 65 wrote:Bobby Fischer and I once beat up a couple of drunks outside of CBGB's in NYC. He also ate an entire loaf of rye bread with peanut butter on a bet (I lost). He was fun to hang out with.

Woof! - Scott

That was you and Bobby? Jeeze, my friend still has a wobbly molar, and I have a scar from the bite on my crotch ...

KLA2 wrote:"The evil that men do lives after them, The good is oft interred with their bones."

- WS

He had a quote for everything. :)

Yep, KLA2, that was Bobby!

Woof! - Scott